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Thread: 8X AGP and PCI Express 16x?

  1. #1
    Platinum+ Member bhxtyrant's Avatar
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    8X AGP and PCI Express 16x?

    Hey guys i wanted to ask is there a motherboard that has both AGP 8x as well as PCI Express all on a sinlge motherboard?Ive been looking but so far it looks like there isnt.If possible i would prefer to have both avalible to support current and future hardware.

  2. #2
    Senior Member beelzebub's Avatar
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    That is impossible. Agp and pci-e are two different architectures. One is serial and one is parallel. In order for that to work a motherboard with two different chipsets would be needed and they both could not be connected or be connected to the same hardware. So, you would have two different computers in one case.

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    Titanium Member efc's Avatar
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    Try this one. LINK

    And

    LINK

    And

    LINK
    Last edited by efc; March 23rd, 2005 at 02:23 AM.
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    Security Intelligence TZ Veteran cash_site's Avatar
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    yeah you might have to re-phrase your questions... are you looking for AGP and PCI-X for both to be used as graphic slots (not simultanously ofcourse), or a motherboard with AGP and PCI-express slots for add-in expansion cards... PCI-express comes in x1 or x16... most graphic slots are x16 but not sure if other devices can use it... check out Efc's links... good pics for clear explanation

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  5. #5
    Senior Member beelzebub's Avatar
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    Well I guess I was wrong. But, the first link is a PCI-X board not pci-e. The second and third board are interesting. Maybe, they are not true AGP slots but are like adapters of some sort that alow an AGP card to work with pci-e. Kind of like the way nvidia did their 6800 series instead of making a native pci-e 6800 gpu they just put a pci-e, AGP adapter on the card. Only in this case the adapter is on the motherboard instead of the card.

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    Senior Member beelzebub's Avatar
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    crash_site because pci-e is serial any pci-e card can plug into a pci-e x16 slot infact you can take a pci-e x16 card and tape up a few of the pins to make it a pci-e x8 and tape up more to make it x4 or x2 or x1. There ar every good explinations on the net, because by all means I dont remember everything about the architecture.

  7. #7
    Platinum+ Member bhxtyrant's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cash_site
    yeah you might have to re-phrase your questions... are you looking for AGP and PCI-X for both to be used as graphic slots (not simultanously ofcourse), or a motherboard with AGP and PCI-express slots for add-in expansion cards... PCI-express comes in x1 or x16... most graphic slots are x16 but not sure if other devices can use it... check out Efc's links... good pics for clear explanation
    Well Let me explain a bit more.I was wondering if there was a MB that had both AGP and PCI-E slots built in that could be used as a graphics card slot (not simultaniously) the reason is because my current graphics card is decent but its an AGP 8X card.So i was hoping to find info on a Motherboard that had both types of slots (AGP and PCI-E 16x) so in the future when i upgrade my graphics card i wont have to get yet another new motherboard.I alswo took a look at the above boards (thanks by the way efc) but i was hoping to find one that supports the AMD 64 939 chips.
    Last edited by bhxtyrant; March 23rd, 2005 at 05:34 AM.

  8. #8
    The Beast Master TZ Veteran PIPER's Avatar
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    Not sure what issue it was in, but PC World has an article about 8x AGP vs PCI Express graphics cards and the bench mark test results on the top ten graphics boards....in most cases the pci trailed the AGP cards...frame rates etc etc. Tis more important to look at your cpu first...if your not at least 2 GHZ then upgrade your MB first, then consider your gpu...they say the only advantage to going with pci express would be avoiding having to possibly do it down the road..being a year or so to stay a step ahead of technology...

  9. #9
    Hardware guy Super Moderator FastGame's Avatar
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    There's very little (if at all) performance difference between 8X AGP and PCI-E at this moment.

    The video card is the most expensive investment. When it comes time for you to upgrade there's going to be better MB's plus the one's out now will be much cheaper.

    This upgrade for the future thing (except for Ram) is a trap IMO, when you do it in bits & pieces part of your system is always out dated. Even if you upgrade all at once your system will be outdated months down the road.

    This is what I'd do if I were you...Checkout the best 939 AGP MB's and compare the price against the best 939 SLI MB's, subtract the price difference and put that money in the bank. When it comes time to upgrade your GFX card the money you have in the bank just might buy you what is today the best 939 SLI MB or greatly lessen the cost of what ever is the best when you upgrade.

    In other words get a good 939 AGP board and don't worry about it, unless your going to upgrade your GFX card soon.

  10. #10
    The Beast Master TZ Veteran PIPER's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by FastGame
    There's very little (if at all) performance difference between 8X AGP and PCI-E at this moment.

    The video card is the most expensive investment. When it comes time for you to upgrade there's going to be better MB's plus the one's out now will be much cheaper.

    This upgrade for the future thing (except for Ram) is a trap IMO, when you do it in bits & pieces part of your system is always out dated. Even if you upgrade all at once your system will be outdated months down the road.
    for sure FG...this is the one constant in the entire formula....but the industry is betting on peoples reactions to be just that....bigger, better, faster....blah blah blah...I for one, have built my last puter....been chasing technology just like the rest of the world...enough is enough. When the games finally exceed my systems power...then I will continue to play the ones that I have...in most cases they are the same thing, only a little different...I am going to spend the extra funds on "Better Beer"....lmao
    Last edited by FastGame; March 23rd, 2005 at 10:03 AM. Reason: Fixed Quote

  11. #11
    Senior Member beelzebub's Avatar
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    The only reason why the current pci-e cards are about equal in benchmark scores to AGP 8x cards is that all the current GPU's were designed for the AGP interface. Currently there is no native pci-e GPU other than the ATI x800 x700 x600 series. There is one board on newegg.com that has both AGP and pci-e for socket 939. It goes for about $117. I would provide a link, but with 56k i am to lazy.

  12. #12
    Silver Member joshsiao's Avatar
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    That is very true, technology today moves so fast! Graphics cards are churned out ever faster and faster every six months. What is the best today won't be in another year. The value of any piece of technology depriciates expotentially. Take my Audigy 2 ZS for example. I paid S$275 (US$170) one year ago. Now it is only S$157 (US$100).

    If I were an economist, I would agree that the video card is the largest investment but also the largest liability. The 9800 PRO that I have costs over S$1000 when it came out. Now, the power is almost quadrupled by the X800 XT and the 9800 PRO costs only S$500.

    The good guage to upgrade is when playing the latest games get unbearbly laggy. I usually look at the specs required for the game. If my computer falls between required and recommended specs, I upgrade. But this is all up to your own usage requirements.
    "Never seem more learnt then the people you are with. Wear your learning like a watch and keep it hidden. Do not pull it out to count the hours, but give the time when you are asked."
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  13. #13
    British Stud Muffin TZ Veteran GimieGimieGimie's Avatar
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    Just to throw in my 2 cents.

    Even though products specifications are always being improved and surpassed (in terms of performance increase noticable to the human eye), i've now come to believe pc technology "doesn't" actually out date as fast and as quickly as most people claim/perceive.

    At least to the extent that the newest technology actually achieves more of most users demands, for example, i've just recently built an old Intel 2.6gig Celeron with 512mb of PC2100 DDR RAM, 80gb ATA 133 HD, with a top notch ASUS motherboard, and only a Geforce 4 MX budget graphics card for DIRT CHEAP, this system can do anything i throw at it that my technologicly advanced AMD 3000 Barton, 512mb PC3200, ATI RADEON 9600 PRO graphics card pc can, apart from graphically advanced games of course

    Needless to say, i'm more then pleasently surprized at this, my usage demands on a pc on average might be concidered low though, here is a list of activities i do (not in order of preference):

    1. Browse net,
    2. Watch films/videos/porn,
    3. Play all my music needs,
    4. Office applications,
    5. Webcaming/Instant Messenging,
    6. Gaming,
    7. Networking,

    That's all i can think of right now, actually, i'm going to make a new thread on peoples computer usages, i've always wanted to know what other people use their pcs for apart from the usual internet usage and gaming, think i'll do that now actually

    Anyway, back to my point i'm trying to make today, technology might always be advancing, but now a days, it's all about the money, and the performance gains simply doesn't justify the costs, especially when it comes to graphics cards!

    A good example is the ATI RADEON series i've recently been researching, i laugh at the fact that they release another series of card that costs more money because they update their pixel shader a little, but the performance of the card hardly changes at all, so performance in the games doesn't increase, but if your lucky, the game might support the new software and look a little better, lol

    And what about the 9200SE, 9600SE and 9800SE series!?

    How can you call a cut down version (half the power) of the original chip set (SECOND EDITION?)

    Of course it's the 2nd edition, but they make it out like it's a more improved/advanced version of the original, clever marketing to fool the public, scum.

    Keep an eye on the graphics world, they are all a bunch of con artists
    Last edited by GimieGimieGimie; March 24th, 2005 at 13:16 PM.

  14. #14
    Senior Member beelzebub's Avatar
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    Ya for most things an old 800 mhz HP vectra computer does the job fine. For gaming the tech. of 5 years ago will undoubtably do. Especially, if the average gamer is into playing the classic online multiplayer games like starcraft and CS. But, for those new games that were designed with the 6800 Ultra in mind some up to date hardware is needed. 128mb of pc-2100 with an 800mhz processor with a FX-5500 just wont cut it. you have to have at least 512mb of pc-3200 a minimum of an AMD XP 2400+ and a ATI 9800 or equivalent.

    But, it is all about bragging rights. That is why we or at least my group of friends waste money on the best of the best and case mods and the best sound system.

    If only I could win the California Lotto I could make the most kick ass system ever. Or at least up until the new hardware comes out.

  15. #15
    Security Intelligence TZ Veteran cash_site's Avatar
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    LOL, inline with beelze's comments... my 800 Duron does just fine too... enough to potentially hassle FG in CoD

    I dont care much about highest FPS... never have the cash for latest/greatest... more about using/tweaking what i have... wireframe 3D Doom3 is cool at 25 FPS .... no texture details, lol 320x280 resolution... hehe

    I just like playing the games and having fun...

    I agree that most top end devices are very similar, and year on year too... so atm not much difference between AGP 4x, 8x let alone AGP to PCI-e....

    so, on topic... it would be good to find a reliable agp & pci-e board... so you can use your still good 9700/9800 Pro card and wait until there is actually a 'real' difference with PCI-e card

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