well I see this has gotten way out of hand so why doesnt the staff talk about some solutions and see what we come up with. I would hate to lose so ol' timers due to a few over bias members that dont like america. but the other side of the token guys this is not an american forum. we have peeps from all over, that feel differently and hold different beliefs and social structures. but if there is that much tension maybe we should just ax the thread all together or like I was mentioning to rev and boogs maybe put a disclaimer that flaming and disrespect will lead to a perm. ban.